Opinons on mafia stories?

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#102

I’ve started to read a handful of them (mostly because like every other story on Episode right now appears to be a mafia/gang story). I’ve finished some of them too. I get the romanticization concerns, especially given the QUANTITY of stories with the whole “broken girl meets intense/overprotective/rude mafia leader then they fall in love” premise, but I don’t inherently hate the idea of mafia/gang stories, I guess? I mean, they are people too, so they have stories that can be told. I think I’m more annoyed with the overkill of the premise I mentioned above. Would be interesting to see more stories about reluctant members or members who want to leave or something.

Also, someone mentioned Are All Monsters Evil, and I’ve finally finished it (like literally just now), and I found it more frustrating in terms of the female MC than in terms of the mafia stuff itself. I don’t think it romanticized the mafia, necessarily, because it did show/discuss the killing and stuff. Unless the idea of falling in love with a mafia in and of itself is considered the romanticization… In which case, that’s every story on the app that involves mafia/gang members lol. Also figured I’d note, in case anyone saw it mentioned and is thinking about reading it, that I’m pretty sure it’s a choice-less story. I can’t remember if that’s 100% true because it’s 40+ chapters, but in these last 5 or so chapters, there’s not a single choice, which I started to find more frustrating as the female MC started to develop certain viewpoints/hard stances that really just like… clash with my own. But that’s a personal thing.

TLDR: There’s WAY too many of them on the app and idk why so many people are writing them, especially when the premises are pretty much the same for the vast majority I’ve seen; however, I still read some of them because what else I’ma do during this covid mess?!

1 Like
#103

Ok so I got the inspo to make this from this :point_right: Discussion: Toxic and Abusive MCs

You should check it out lol

Anyways, I wanted to know your guys’ thought on Mafia. I’m personally writing a story about the mafia so this might sound really hypocritical but whatever

  • Mafia stories on episode heavily misrepresent the mafia. Mafia leaders aren’t hot (which I’ll admit that I’m guilty of making them like that)

  • Mafia leaders aren’t going to fall in love with their hostages

  • Mafia leaders don’t have morals

  • Mafia leaders aren’t afraid to kill a child

  • Mafia leaders don’t care if you’re a woman or not, they’ll kill you without a second thought

  • These kind of stories can offend people that have had an experience from these people

  • Killing people isn’t “hot” and anyone who writes these kind of stories (myself included) should write it like it is, immoral. There’s absolutely no point into making something like that “hot”, “sexy”, or “sensual”. The only “reason” there would be a need for these kind of things would be for the sake of a romantic aspect

  • Romance isn’t everything. There doesn’t have to be romance in every single story, especially if the only way you can do that is to glorify something that is responsible for so many horrible things that happen in the world

  • Also if you want to write a mafia story don’t romanticize or glorify that kind of lifestyle there’s many ways to avoid all those things.

I also want to talk about MC’s in these kind of stories. Usually mafia stories revolve around how the MC accidentally saw something she shouldn’t have and then got kidnapped but instead of the MC being scared for her life she checks the LI out. I don’t know if it’s just me but I’d be scared if someone was trying to kidnap me but ig MC’s in episode are just built different :woman_shrugging:

I’m not trying to bash these stories in any kind of way and I know that this is episode and they’re all fiction but I just wanted to say these things because some kids on this app don’t understand these things and these stories are way too normalized

Let me know your thoughts on this :kissing: Cuz I’m lowkey curious

Also don’t know if there’s already a thread made abt this

8 Likes
#104

I feel like it all depends, to be honest. Mafia people are still human too. I’ve seen a few interviews of real life Mafia Capos or people linked. Some of the leaders are quite attractive, actually, though most are on the older side. And some are on the younger side as well, the youngest being 26 (Joseph Bonnano).

A lot of Mafia people do have morals, and a lot consider themselves close with their families simply because of culture. But of course, this isn’t all.

Many crime lords have openly done what they’ve done for their family’s actually. Take El Chappo for instance: Notorious criminal, drug lord, killer, but absolutely adored his children more than anyone.

Mafia leaders are of course… Mafia Leaders. They’re criminals, but just because someone is a criminal, doesn’t mean they have no morals. They may differ in many senses, or things that are more important to lawful people are less important to those who aren’t.

So making your mafia character attractive isn’t unrealistic at all, nor is making them fairly young. Making your mafia character have morals isn’t unrealistic either. Overall, it’s still realistic fiction.

6 Likes
#105

I’m not sure 100% on how I feel about this whole topic.

Episode is a fictional story game. Therefore, the stories are not real life. Just like tv shows about vampires, they’re not real. I think it starts to really depend on what the limits are for Episode stories in general.

When you say they’re not hot, and they don’t keep their hostages etc. that is probably true (it’s not like I know indefinitely.) But again, it’s a fiction game. These characters aren’t supposed to be real or portray people who are real.

I do think if people make these types of stories, they should have warnings saying:
This is only fiction, none of this is based on real life (or something like that.)

I feel like almost every 13+ person should know none of these stories are based on real events, but some younger people may lie about their age. That is when I feel like it starts to get complicated, and why you should definitely add warnings like that.

Now, of course everyone still has to stick to the guidelines too. You can’t promote abuse etc.

But, yeah…I feel like this topic is just complicated. If someone wants to do a story about this, and the girl “changing the guy” they should be aloud to. They just can’t promote anything off the guileless and should have a warning like I said.

This is just how I feel though. :llama:

2 Likes
#106

I agree I wasn’t trying to bash on these kind of stories in any way, everyone should be able to have their creative freedom I just wanted to say this because they’re kids on the app who don’t understand these things and people that might get offended with mafia stories

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#107

Defending mafia leaders who rapes, murders and commit other atrocities?!
IMG_20200906_210306

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#108

Oh yeah, no it’s fine! I totally get where you’re coming from. That’s why I think that people should always have warnings about these kinds of things. Overall, I guess it’s their story. If it follows the guidelines then it’s okay I guessss. But, I do agree a lot with you about the kids on this app. I hope no one thinks some of these stories on based on real life. :slightly_frowning_face:

1 Like
#109

I don’t want to be rude, but if at this point, after seeing handfuls of people thoroughly explain how terrible, disgusting and murderous the mafia is, and why it shouldn’t be romanticized, you still choose to defend it, you’re insensitive to other people’s situations and think your story is more important than people’s suffering being romanticized. I don’t understand why some of ya’ll are so dead sett on glorifying the mafia, literally just write about something else that doesn’t make light of someone’s pain. There are thousands and thousands of different tropes out there who are perfectly okay to write about, hell, you can even write a mafia story that doesn’t romanticize it, the options are endless, but you’re still convinced it’s appropriate to write fluffy romance about a disgusting organization that murdered so many innocent people for their own selfish gain.

It’s not about them “being human too” what type of sick human being thinks it’s acceptable to literally kill someone. It’s not about them being “attractive” either, because what difference does it make whether they’re young and “attractive” or old and balding? They’re still killers, abusers, and terrible people.

What good is loving a few carefully selected people if you’re going to threaten everyone else around you. Why should someone be praised for doing the bare minimum of loving their children, while they take other people’s children’s lives away. Those aren’t and will never be morals, and they shouldn’t be treated as such either.

Making criminals look attractive, especially on a 12+ audience app is so harmful. Why should we teach children to sympathize with murderers while authors should just understand it’s insensitive to romanticize a murderous organization. Why are so many people still ignoring the effects the media, books, movies, stories, everything has on us, and how it shapes our actions, thoughts, and our lives in general. It’s not complicated, it’s not “just fiction” it’s simply insensitive and it really shows the lack of morality some people have.

Ignoring the effects “fiction” has on us, especially while ignoring how it effected you to the point of defending a sick organization that would kill you in a heartbeat if they had the chance, isn’t helping anyone.

I’ll just end with saying that if you know about how disgusting the mafia is and still choose to defend stories that glorify it every chance you get, that says a lot about how insensitive you are towards other people who have suffered through what you choose to romanticize.

10 Likes
#110

Idk if this was directed towards me but I wasn’t defending mafia leaders or anyone involved with it I was saying that a lot of these kind of stories on the app do

If this wasn’t directed towards me just ignore this lol

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#111

It wasn’t directed towards you lol, I just know the mafia stans are gonna show up soon to bring up the usual “they’re human too :broken_heart: :pensive:” so I’m just saying what I usually say before they start to argue.

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#112

Oh ok lol

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#113

I agree with what you’re saying, and overall I don’t think people should exactly create stories like this because it can be harmful to the viewers. That’s why I think if anyone creates a story like this they should definitely at least have warnings describing why none of this is based on real life and could be insensitive (I don’t see warnings like this on all the popular stories relating to this topic, only about how it contains mature themes etc.)

I mean, so many people read stories like this and the viewers don’t see anything wrong with it. Episode should be more diligent with what they’re allowing people to post stories about. I think this topic isn’t very good for kids/teens to be reading about because they know nothing about it.

You opened my eyes more. I wasn’t sure how bad it actually was. What you described seems very very scary. I can’t imagine what anyone would feel if they ever experienced something like that. These types of stories are just veryy mature, and I think they should only be shared on 18+ site if anything. At least most people know what they’re getting into.

3 Likes
#114

I’m not going to say that you’re wrong, because you’re not. I’m also not going to defend the mafia because I completely agree with you in the fact that killers shouldn’t be seen as terrible people, because cold-blooded murderers are just that. What I want to defend are the writers and the stories about them.

Stories are meant to create entertainment and cover certain themes that we see in life. And, as a writer of one of those stories myself (judge me if you must), I know that my intent is never to show a good side to people in the mafia, but to emphasize the point that everyone is capable of doing good things. In addition, I am a hopeless romantic and I find that fantasizing about the extremes helps me to believe that I if someone like that can find someone to love them, then I could, too. I like to believe that there is someone for everyone.

In addition, while there are suggestions that these stories are bad influences on kids, kids should not be reading these. There have also been studies that violent stories and video games may help release built up stress, anxiety, or anger in kids. Also, not all people are affected this way. If a kid in their teens, even preteens, were to read this, they already should already know these rights from wrongs. As a person who has watched violent movies, read violent stories, and played violent video games, I know from experience that I never have ever thought that a mafia leader or killer was a good person.

I am not trying to convince you that these mafia stories should be praised by you or anyone else. I am not going to tell you even that you should stop hating on people who enjoy these. The only thing that ask of you is to understand that these stories are not written for one reason. They are not written to praise killers. Maybe people who write these stories are less sensitive to violence, but huge majority of us don’t write because of any bad intentions. Maybe I’m wrong and I’m just as ignorant and insensitive as you say. If so I apologize. I never meant to offend anyone or suggest any of the ideas you have said.

I just wanted to show another side to this argument. Whether right or wrong, this opinion is out there. So I thank you for reading this post.

1 Like
#115

I just feel like already having an LI in the mafia glamorizes it. And having the LI be “irresistible” always makes the MC stay in dangerous situations where she’s kidnapped or has witnessed something she shouldn’t have like @Shrek_ogre said.

Not all of those stories are bad, though. I used to read quiet a few of them.

2 Likes
#116

I agree, as someone who’s writing a story about the mafia my intent is to entertain people and not glorify or romanticize these kind of lifestyles.

Of course they will be kids that do understand that these kind of things aren’t ok but not every kid is like that and not every kid cares if they’re at the age to have a certain app

When I made this topic I had no intent to bash on these kind of stories I just wanted to spread awareness about these kind of things, there’s ways to not glorify or romanticize these things. Some authors that have written popular mafia stories don’t do their research and it’s really clear who does and doesn’t and that’s the main thing I wanted people to get from this topic

1 Like
#117

TW: mentions of r-pe and murder

I respect your opinion, but I completely disagree, because I simply don’t agree with romanticizing someone else’s pain for the sake of my story. It’s so insensitive to what others have suffered through. People choose to romanticize the mafia to “escape their reality” while not understanding it’s someone’s actual reality they can’t escape.

Murder, rape, threatening families, burning down buildings, killing livestock, assassinating literal children all things the mafia has done and continues to do to this day. This literally isn’t entertainment, it’s real life situations people have had to endure, which you are choosing to glorify. Why is it acceptable for someone to take someone’s pain and write a fluffy romance with it just because you want to “escape your reality”.

I would suggest looking up intent vs impact. It doesn’t matter what your intent was if your impact is harmful, and I truly do believe more people need to understand that.

But why should anyone need to sympathize with a killer simply because they’re able to “do good things”. Why should some good acts completely hide all the atrocious crimes they’ve committed? I don’t understand why people can’t understand this: They’ve killed people, they’ve raped people, they’ve burned down houses, buildings, stores. Italy is still suffering from it’s effects today, but you still think it’s acceptable to romanticize it because “they’re capable of doing good things”?

Like I already said in my previous post, there’s literally endless tropes out there you could write about that can show you all types of people can find love. I just want you to tell me, since I’ve asked a handful of people but none of them could give me a clear answer, why does it have to be the mafia? What’s so appealing about killers?

Episode is literally a 12+ app, stories are supposed to be appropriate for them to read lol. And it’s not just about them being “bad influences”, it’s about understanding the horrific history behind it and understanding why it’s literally not appropriate to glorify it.

Once again, why does it have to be the mafia?

But some people are, and I care about how those people are affected. I also care about the people who are affected by seeing their pain romanticized for some quick reads.

Most brains aren’t developed until you’re 25. The prefrontal cortex, which plays a big part in decisions making, just started to develop at age 12. I’m not going to sit here and hold a bunch of 12 year old’s accountable to knowing “right from wrong” when I could be holding the actual adult authors writing these sick fantasies on a children’s app.

It’s not about you though. I couldn’t care less whether people realize it’s “not real” or “just fiction” I care that some people are willing to glorify other’s pain and suffering for their stories. It’s insensitive.

I’ll stop “hating” on them when they stop glorifying rapists and murderers.

Once again, intent vs. impact.

Bottom line is, I can see you already understand what type of sick human beings belong to the mafia, if you still think it’s acceptable to glorify them to “escape your reality” I don’t know what to tell you.

5 Likes
#118

@corvus.writes explained so well. Stop saying is fiction. Imagine a story with a LI that is a terrorist, would u be okay with it? I don’t think so. It’s wrong and it’s the same thing as Mafia.
Being hot doesn’t justify being a criminal
If u “have morals” u don’t kill people
If love your child you don’t kill other children.
Stop.
I don’t think that’s difficult to understand.

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#119

Italian here.
Mafia leaders did help their communities, they’re such sweethearts! Here they built highways, bridges, even entire neighborhoods!
Because of their high morals they started to kidnap children during the 70s, 80s and 90s, and instead of spending that money for themselves (I mean, high morals here!) they decided to use that money to bribe and corrupt influent people in order to win public tenders. That’s the kind of morals they have. They don’t help their people: first they scare them off, then they merely “buy” them by offering them some services that the government can’t give them, and the government can’t give those service to them because it’s ostracized by mafia itself. The good old carrot and stick story. Morals my axs.
The fact that there’s still some humanity behind all the sh*t they’re covered with is just what draws the line between them and animals.

2 Likes
#120

I can see your side of it, I completely agree with you. My point was just that morals are subjective and even if many have a corrupt sense of good and bad many don’t see the corruptness of that. Again it all depends, I was in no way trying to justify the behavior :grimacing:

#121

I’m sorry but morals can only be subjective up to a certain point. And if they weren’t aware of the lack of their morals they wouldn’t be spending most of their lives trying to rule entire cities while hiding in bunkers just like rats :sweat_smile:

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