Toxic and Problematic Themes In Popular Stories

I didn’t say that you couldn’t voice your opinion. I’m saying, if you are really so against a story or unhappy with a central theme, why would you continue to read it? If something is making you unhappy, do you want to finish the story to see how it ends? I’ve had several stories that I started to read-- And I liked the first few chapters a lot, and then, maybe the character did something that I disagreed with or couldn’t understand, and I removed it from my favorites and went to read another. I just think, overall, the point of the episode app is for entertainment, or community, and if you aren’t entertained by one story, I’m sure there are others that you would like more.
Telling authors that what they write isn’t appropriate… when the author has millions of reads, likely doesn’t have much of an impact.
I haven’t seen any stories that idolize abuse or any such inappropriate behavior. The closest one would be A Toxic Relationship but she makes it clear that it isn’t a romance story-- that the behaviors of the male main character are not ok and damaging, and she doesn’t condone his behaviors, she condemns them. I read the story because I was a psychology major. This kind of stuff interests me. Like, for example: I’d rather watch You on Netflix than Gossip Girl. Just a different preference.

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Clearly not listening. I said that no one is glorifying inappropriate behavior. It’s a discussion in the story. Not a celebration of it.

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Okay, but you are literally saying this and something vise-versa.

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The point of this thread is literally pointing out that when stories are not explicitly condemning these types of behaviors and tropes, they are normalizing it and therefore promoting it, if inadvertently. You can tell people to just not read things that don’t interest them, but it doesn’t make the tropes any less harmful, especially for young teens. Doesn’t matter how often you tell people it’s “just a story” - reality shapes and is shaped by ALL media, among other things, including Episode. Nothing exists in a vacuum. And if an author can’t “entertain” readers without having their characters abused or demeaned, then it’s worth putting some critical thinking into why on Earth the most entertaining thing is causing people harm.

The idea that there’s no conflict in a story without characters being assaulted, abused, or harassed is actually quite offensive and definitely short-sighted. A “fairy tale” in the sense you’re talking about isn’t 20 chapters of people being happy and never learning anything new about themselves or the world. Humans are so complex and we have the ability to create complex characters as a result, and you can and should have complex, well-developed characters who aren’t suffering from abuse and then brushing it off as if it doesn’t affect them.

I’m not expecting you to agree, but I will say that if your “preferences” include harming people, it might be time to think about why that is and how larger cultural norms have influenced them. If I find something not problematic but no longer interesting to me, I move on. That’s a preference and a choice. We know we have choices about what we read. Personally, when I come across these tropes I keep reading for a while see the in-universe response S well as the community response. But I am often disappointed. Even if you want to argue that everyone is entitled to their opinion, no one is required to refrain from offering a critique of that opinion. I hope you have read and will consider all the replies in this thread. It shouldn’t be too much to ask for a character not to be shown getting sexually assaulted or for a love interest to be nice to the girl he’s supposedly interested in dating.

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This is not true. There are so many stories that actually don’t promote such things, and that are appropriate for this app. And yes, no one forces me to read a story I don’t like, but how do I know that I don’t like it without reading? What do I do when I’m in episode 4, and something like this comes up out of the blue without a trigger warning? I can’t unsee it, and others can’t unsee it either. I’d love to think that this is just a game, and these stories don’t do actual harm, but I can’t because there are people irl too who don’t even acknowledge that they live in a toxic relationship, and these stories do nothing but encourage them. It’s also very concerning that I even see readers commenting that they want the abusive jerk to be the love interest in a story, even if the author never suggested this option.

And Lilly, for your questions:

Yes, and hell yes

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I think I made a topic that discusses this issue with the new guidelines if you’d like to read that one :smiley:

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I agree with Amber when she said that she’s tired of people telling us don’t read something if we don’t like it.

First of all, most stories don’t include trigger warnings or content warnings to explain what we are about to read. So, to say, “if you don’t like it, don’t read it” is such a dumb thing to say especially if we are be blind-sided.

So, you like reading about toxic and triggering content in episode stories because it’s real life? Fine, that’s you, but not everyone wants to read insensitive poorly handled topics especially when it is a trigger.

… What? No, it wouldn’t. Nobody on this thread has stated that they want every story to be strictly PG. You can have a story that has real life situations, but still handled properly. Also, the topic of the post is to talk about toxic and problematic themes.

90% perfect of the stories are condemning toxic relationships. If you don’t see that and you think that those relationships are normal, then hmm :woozy_face:

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I am in love with the second part of your post, especially the straight women on Twitter part!

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11 times yes, it is horrifying to me that many of these are encountered in community stories, who writes community stories?
Young teenagers, especially girls, and it blows my mind if these types of stories are the most common, read and written, almost as if toxic relationships are the usual ones, or they are the ones that are “worth” talking about.
I seriously worry, both for the boys and the girls (especially the latter ones) of future generations if this is the material they tend to consume

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Yes, I agree… :wink:

I think I meant to say that I said something like that on another topic lol, you’ve explained the whole topic much better than I could :smiley:

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Well I’m just gonna say what I think about this topic some of the stuff in this thread and then go. A lot of these authors could write up conflict that doesn’t involve someone getting drugged, the LI being a serial cheater or sumn, or just one mean girl that was created just to be the sole antagonist. I hate when SA is used as a plot device because there’s definetly other situations you can write to make your LI look good. They can make the LI romantic without toxic possessiveness, trapping an LI against a wall to forcibly kiss them, and stuff about how they could barely “control themselves.”

I’ve seen a toxic relationship in action and it not only effects them but everyone else around them. For example, my grandparents that were in a long toxic relationship where my grandfather would be overly controlling, possessive, and verbally and/or emotionally abuse my grandmother who was basically treated like a brainless servant. The basis of their relationship was already toxic and bad to begin with because my grandfather was from a rich family and my grandmother was a maid for his family. Then they ran away together from my grandfather’s disapproving family. Sounds familiar? That’s probably because it could be a trending story on Episode.

My grandmother didn’t know better though and hadn’t ever tried to get out of the relationship because it’s all she knew. My grandfather would try to pamper her with gifts to basically gloss over his toxic ways. It’s affected how some of my uncles treat other women because that toxic relationship was what they grew up with and saw.

I wonder if the prevalence of all these harmful tropes in stories just had to do with the fact that society holds men to a lower standard where they’re praised for the bare minimum. Maybe it’s been so ingrained in culture through media that people are so uncreative to write non-toxic stuff. Or … it’s just simply what sells.

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Let’s start…

Uhm, yes. All the time. It’s kinda awful that episode is glamorizing, gang violence, cheating, drug usage, blackmail, murder… Oh yeah, I forgot, this is a love story :woman_facepalming:t3:. And then the worst part, is that the MC usually ends up with the LI in the end. Talk about a safe, stable, and LOVING relationship

This app is 13+. You would be surprised, some 13-year-olds may make choices based off on episode stories. Epi has got to pull it together, and at least demonstrate what a healthy relationship looks like, bc so far, a lot of the LI’s are assholes. If there is a story that violates guildelines, then so help me god, I don’t care how many reads it has, get this sh*t off of episode. No one thinks murder is hot, OK?

At the end of the day, episode is a buisness, but honestly, if this ap[p is 13+, then it better act like it.

That’s all I gotta say.

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Oooo I thought of another problematic trope that I detest. The “Psycho Ex Girlfriend” trope. I will preface this by saying that of course I know women are capable of abusive behavior, and many people of all genders are abusers. However, this specific trope is really born out of intensive misogyny. In real life, this trope comes from douchebag dudes who never listen to their girlfriends or respect their boundaries, then get tired of listening to their girlfriends nag (i.e. ask their boyfriends to show them some damn respect). So the guy characterises the ex-girlfriend as clingy and naggy and someone who doesn’t understand personal space and is “obsessed with him.” In reality, he’s just been ignoring the girl he’s been in a relationships for so long that she doesn’t know how else to communicate how unloved she feels. They break up and she doesn’t know what she’s done wrong so she’s trying to find some answers. I mean, of course, if someone breaks up with you the best thing to do is leave them alone, but sometimes it’s hard when the relationship has been so damaging in the first place. Then dudes talk to their dude friends about their “psycho” exes and I dunno, sniff each other’s axe body spray or whatever they do.

But in media, including and maybe especially Episode, this trope always gets portrayed as “my ex cheated on me and stalked me and tried to kill me and now she wants to kill you” (sort of hyperbolic, though some are this extreme). All as fodder to show how patient and Cool Girl™ the MC is. So all the women in the LI’s past are just ~crazy~ and all the girls he’s slept with before getting obsessed with the MC are also ~crazy but sExY sex objects as well~ The Psycho Ex-Girlfriend really emotionally damaged the LI and that’s why he’s such a jerkbag to all women, including the MC up until the last like 3 episodes, and we’re supposed to forgive him because it has been so hard for him to deal with all these crazy exes. Poor LI, so sad. I’m really over this trope. Especially because even those relationships are portrayed so shallowly. The LI was always so doting and nice and the psycho ex was had no personality besides being a model and being crazy, and because of that he gets to treat all other women like trash. Like I said, there are a lot of women abusers and I’m not denying that. But even if you’re talking about an abusive relationship, there’s a lot you don’t really need to show us. Most of the time, though, this trope exists solely to paint the LI as a hero for putting up with her for so long and make the MC feel bad about telling him not to be a jerk. Give me a break lol

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It isn’t the point. There are far more stories that normalize getting into a relationship with a millionaire which hosts more toxicity than someone talking about instances of a harmful relationship that actually happened in their lives.

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No one is dismissing anyone’s opinion. In my statement that someone flagged and hid I said everyone’s opinion is valid. Asking someone why they would continue to read a story that upsets them is a valid opinion.

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Thank you. I do not know. I simply stated my opinion. And there are others who must agree or the stories would not be read. It would be one thing if stories are writing “tropes” to get more reads. But that could be said about all of the stories that fantasize about marrying a millionaire or becoming a star. These are stories that portray someone’s voice. Everyone is valid.

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Here’s the answer for your question.

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Saying “don’t read it, if you don’t like it” is dismissive as you never know who is on the other side, what they went through nor how it resonates on them.

I get that for you and some others these tropes are not toxic nor problematic, as others in this thread have stated, it’s for them.

For example, the common plot driver, drugging characters has become so common that even using it is problematic because there is little to no author coming on the end of the episode and saying how wrong it’s.
Other is teen pregnancy, you say it happens in real life but again only a handful of authors portrays the worries and the real life issues, other than the will I become so fat that he won’t want me anymore?

These authors have stories with loads of reads, good for them but utterly bad for those who went through some one the poorly portrayed experiences and read their stories, and “fell on a trap”.

The major issue that we have with toxic and problematic themes is how poorly they are handled. Not reading it, will not change the content and how it was handled.

Don’t say it’s just a game, when it has been shown on news how games can influence.

So the whole mindset “don’t read it, if you don’t like it” which means “you’re just being dramatic” is dismissive.

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Yes, it really is.

Having a character get assaulted or be victim to an abusive relationship and just brushing it off is normalizing the behavior. Showing toxic, possessive, and manipulative behavior from a Love Interest (or MC) as desirable is normalizing the behavior. Use of the word “trope” implies a negative connotation towards how these events and dynamics are portrayed. No one is saying these topics can absolutely never be talked about, but the impact of these events and how they shape the way the character sees the world, themselves, and their relations to others needs to be addressed seriously, and appropriate trigger and content warnings need to be in place. It can be and has been done.

Who here is stanning millionaires? Most of us would agree that the tropes we’re expressing concern about often, though not necessarily always, go hand in hand with a lot of the millionaire / billionaire romances.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but not all opinions are equally valid. Those who have been or are being harmed should have their voices prioritized over those who are causing or perpetuating harm. That is how we ensure safety & solidarity for those who are most vulnerable. Just because others may not find these tropes problematic or harmful doesn’t mean they aren’t. What we find acceptable or desirable is shaped by the world around us. But if you listen to those who have been on the receiving end of the most harm, you can think critically about why anyone would find these tropes acceptable and realize how they further shape our reality.

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